Comments on: Hey, what happened to that nonstop flight to Paris? http://www.consumertraveler.com/today/hey-what-happened-to-that-nonstop-flight-to-paris/ The last honest travel site Sun, 12 Feb 2012 14:38:00 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.3.1 By: Joe S http://www.consumertraveler.com/today/hey-what-happened-to-that-nonstop-flight-to-paris/comment-page-1/#comment-9390 Joe S Tue, 13 Jan 2009 22:27:49 +0000 http://www.tripso.com/?p=8261#comment-9390 Karen, When Continental joins the Stat Alliance, you'll be able to connect through Houston to Paris. Though, if you fly in coach, I don't think you'll appreciate 31" of seat pitch. Karen,
When Continental joins the Stat Alliance, you’ll be able to connect through Houston to Paris. Though, if you fly in coach, I don’t think you’ll appreciate 31″ of seat pitch.

]]> By: Frank http://www.consumertraveler.com/today/hey-what-happened-to-that-nonstop-flight-to-paris/comment-page-1/#comment-9389 Frank Tue, 13 Jan 2009 22:01:43 +0000 http://www.tripso.com/?p=8261#comment-9389 Charlie Leocha said In this day and age of corporate cutbacks, airlines are going to be bleeding red ink once again. Rather than taking care of their bread and butter (85+% of their passengers) they focus on the cream. ===================================================== The cream? Ma and Pa Kettle who travel once or twice a year? Dont care who they fly as long as they get the cheapest fare? The Business/Frequent flyers accounts for a high percentage of revenue for all legacy carriers. All, hold seats to the day of departure, and in doing so, are under great pressure to sell those seats to last minute travelers at a HIGH rate. Should the flight go out with those empty seats NOT SOLD, that's "lost revenue" to that airline. Actually, those business travelers subsidize those Ma and Pa Kettles and their airfares! Most airlines were in bankruptcy in the early part of the decade. Most didnt have the capital to invest in fuel hedges, certainly not in bankruptcy. Southwest took advantage of that and hedged. How impressive to see an airline fly around with some of the LOWEST load factors in the industry and still make a profit. Check the DOT stats monthly, load factors are low for them right now. High 60's to Low 70's. Fuel costs are (temporarily) down right now. That works against their hedges, so I predict a loss for them in the final quarter, maybe going to the first. According to this article, WN has plenty of business travelers: Southwest Airlines' CEO knows he'll never have to pay up. There's no way to prove him wrong because airlines don't know the purposes of many customers' trips. http://www.usatoday.com/money/industries/travel/2008-12-25-southwest_N.htm Kelly maintains that internal research shows Southwest is already No. 1 in domestic business travel, and he is steering Southwest to capture even more of the business-travel market in 2009. To accomplish that, he's doing some heavy tinkering with a business model that has kept the airline profitable for an unprecedented 35 consecutive years. Charlie Leocha said
In this day and age of corporate cutbacks, airlines are going to be bleeding red ink once again. Rather than taking care of their bread and butter (85+% of their passengers) they focus on the cream.
=====================================================

The cream? Ma and Pa Kettle who travel once or twice a year? Dont care who they fly as long as they get the cheapest fare? The Business/Frequent flyers accounts for a high percentage of revenue for all legacy carriers. All, hold seats to the day of departure, and in doing so, are under great pressure to sell those seats to last minute travelers at a HIGH rate. Should the flight go out with those empty seats NOT SOLD, that’s “lost revenue” to that airline. Actually, those business travelers subsidize those Ma and Pa Kettles and their airfares!

Most airlines were in bankruptcy in the early part of the decade. Most didnt have the capital to invest in fuel hedges, certainly not in bankruptcy. Southwest took advantage of that and hedged. How impressive to see an airline fly around with some of the LOWEST load factors in the industry and still make a profit. Check the DOT stats monthly, load factors are low for them right now. High 60′s to Low 70′s. Fuel costs are (temporarily) down right now. That works against their hedges, so I predict a loss for them in the final quarter, maybe going to the first.

According to this article, WN has plenty of business travelers:

Southwest Airlines’ CEO knows he’ll never have to pay up. There’s no way to prove him wrong because airlines don’t know the purposes of many customers’ trips.

http://www.usatoday.com/money/industries/travel/2008-12-25-southwest_N.htm

Kelly maintains that internal research shows Southwest is already No. 1 in domestic business travel, and he is steering Southwest to capture even more of the business-travel market in 2009. To accomplish that, he’s doing some heavy tinkering with a business model that has kept the airline profitable for an unprecedented 35 consecutive years.

]]> By: Janice Hough http://www.consumertraveler.com/today/hey-what-happened-to-that-nonstop-flight-to-paris/comment-page-1/#comment-9377 Janice Hough Tue, 13 Jan 2009 16:49:35 +0000 http://www.tripso.com/?p=8261#comment-9377 Good points Charlie, but Southwest actually sets their fares so they can make money on the bread and butter. Yes, they are reasonable, but as most of our agents know, they often aren't the cheapest on any given trip...because they dont sell a lot of the lowest discounted seats. And they have a simple system which is cheaper to run. (All the same plane type, no meals, sold or otherwise, no extra fees (which saves time.) Many of the majors run this crazy system where they lose money on many of the seats they sell, in hopes of making it up on the high end traveler. And as we have seen, it doesn't always work. Good points Charlie, but Southwest actually sets their fares so they can make money on the bread and butter. Yes, they are reasonable, but as most of our agents know, they often aren’t the cheapest on any given trip…because they dont sell a lot of the lowest discounted seats. And they have a simple system which is cheaper to run. (All the same plane type, no meals, sold or otherwise, no extra fees (which saves time.) Many of the majors run this crazy system where they lose money on many of the seats they sell, in hopes of making it up on the high end traveler. And as we have seen, it doesn’t always work.

]]> By: Karen Fawcett http://www.consumertraveler.com/today/hey-what-happened-to-that-nonstop-flight-to-paris/comment-page-1/#comment-9371 Karen Fawcett Tue, 13 Jan 2009 14:25:23 +0000 http://www.tripso.com/?p=8261#comment-9371 OK ... here's my rant. I USED to take the non-stop U.A flight from Paris to LA and it was canceled. Then I took the non-stop to SF and transferred to LA. The SF flight was canceled and I was forced to go via IAD or Chicago unless I chose to make the first leg from Paris to London or Frankfurt. But I am still asking (and it's been more than five years), why is there only ONE flight From DC to Paris when there used to be a second one that departed close to midnight. The departure and the arrival times were better for my schedule and for traffic on both sides of the ocean. And both flights were always full. Have faith -- Delta / AF offer non-stops to the West Coast. But for those of us who are Star Alliance members - we need to rethink. OH, by the way, United closed the Paris station and transferred people to Frankfort or to London .... that is if the personnel wanted or could go. Trying to be faithful to United takes an effort. Is United losing money or losing passengers? OK … here’s my rant. I USED to take the non-stop U.A flight from Paris to LA and it was canceled. Then I took the non-stop to SF and transferred to LA.
The SF flight was canceled and I was forced to go via IAD or Chicago unless I chose to make the first leg from Paris to London or Frankfurt.

But I am still asking (and it’s been more than five years), why is there only ONE flight From DC to Paris when there used to be a second one that departed close to midnight. The departure and the arrival times were better for my schedule and for traffic on both sides of the ocean. And both flights were always full.

Have faith — Delta / AF offer non-stops to the West Coast. But for those of us who are Star Alliance members – we need to rethink.

OH, by the way, United closed the Paris station and transferred people to Frankfort or to London …. that is if the personnel wanted or could go. Trying to be faithful to United takes an effort.

Is United losing money or losing passengers?

]]> By: Charlie Leocha http://www.consumertraveler.com/today/hey-what-happened-to-that-nonstop-flight-to-paris/comment-page-1/#comment-9368 Charlie Leocha Tue, 13 Jan 2009 12:19:48 +0000 http://www.tripso.com/?p=8261#comment-9368 I know that Southwest is beginning to make an effort to get more of the last-minute business travel, however, they have had a string of profitable years without a focus on the "front of the plane." Heck, they don't even have a front of the plane. How can they make profits year after year and other airlines can only make a profit when they have plenty of "business travelers." In this day and age of corporate cutbacks, airlines are going to be bleeding red ink once again. Rather than taking care of their bread and butter (85+% of their passengers) they focus on the cream. I know that Southwest is beginning to make an effort to get more of the last-minute business travel, however, they have had a string of profitable years without a focus on the “front of the plane.” Heck, they don’t even have a front of the plane.
How can they make profits year after year and other airlines can only make a profit when they have plenty of “business travelers.”
In this day and age of corporate cutbacks, airlines are going to be bleeding red ink once again. Rather than taking care of their bread and butter (85+% of their passengers) they focus on the cream.

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